Editing Talk:United Kingdom (section)

== Keir Starmer or Sir Keir Starmer? ==

There seems to be an edit war looming so I just want to create a general consensus on whether we use "Keir Starmer" or "Sir Keir Starmer". The former is my choice. [[User:Gammawammallama|Gammawammallama]] ([[User talk:Gammawammallama|talk]]) 08:58, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
:As someone who doesn't care either way, I would ask what do you see as the pro and con arguments or is it just a case of personal preference? I don't see [[MOS:SIR]] providing anything definitive on this particular use as that guidance is about a bio article. [[User:DeCausa|DeCausa]] ([[User talk:DeCausa|talk]]) 09:08, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
::I don't think someone not from the UK cares that Keir Starmer has been knighted and therefore has the "Sir" title. [[User:Gammawammallama|Gammawammallama]] ([[User talk:Gammawammallama|talk]]) 12:33, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
:We should use keir starmer since all countries leaders don't start with first name middle name surname it's first name surname (e.x.narenda modi, joe biden, justin trudeau) [[User:Depotadore|Depotadore]] ([[User talk:Depotadore|talk]]) 14:18, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
::Titles such as Sir should be treated in the same way as titles like Dr., Rev., Mr. or Esq. Note that the monarch is referred to as Charles III, rather than King Charles III. King of course is a much grander title than Sir. [[User:The Four Deuces|TFD]] ([[User talk:The Four Deuces|talk]]) 15:44, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
:::Yes. It's no Sir for me. [[User:HiLo48|HiLo48]] ([[User talk:HiLo48|talk]]) 00:48, 7 July 2024 (UTC)
:Delete the "Sir" bit. [[User:GoodDay|GoodDay]] ([[User talk:GoodDay|talk]]) 03:46, 7 July 2024 (UTC)
:From [[MOS:SIR]]:
:: The honorific titles Sir, Dame, Lord and Lady are included in the initial reference and infobox heading for the subject of a biographical article, but are optional after that. The title is placed in bold in the first use of the name. Except for the initial reference and infobox, do not add honorific titles to existing instances of a person's name where they are absent, because doing so implies that the existing version is incorrect (similar in spirit to the guideline on English spelling differences). Similarly, honorific titles should not be deleted when they are used throughout an article unless there is consensus. Where the use of an honorific title is widely misunderstood, this can be mentioned in the article; see, for example, Bob Geldof. Honorific titles used with forenames only (such as "Sir Elton", "Sir David", "Dame Judi") should be avoided unless this form is so heavily preferred in popular usage that the use of the surname alone would render the entire name unrecognizable.
:TL/DR: use it in the infobox and the first time it appears in the article, after that it's more or less a free-for-all. [[User:Waggers|<b style="color:#98F">W</b><b style="color:#97E">a</b><b style="color:#86D">g</b><b style="color:#75C">ge</b><b  style="color:#83C">r</b><b  style="color:#728">s</b>]][[User talk:Waggers|<small  style="color:#080">''TALK''</small>]] 13:35, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
::As I mentioned above, I don't think MOS:SIR has application here. I think it's intended for the bio articles of the Sirs themselves rather than when they are mentioned in passing in other articles. [[User:DeCausa|DeCausa]] ([[User talk:DeCausa|talk]]) 14:11, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
:::"This page sets out guidelines for achieving visual and textual consistency in biographical articles and in biographical information in other articles; such consistency allows Wikipedia to be used more easily. While this guideline focuses on biographies, its advice pertains, where applicable, to all articles that mention people." [[User:Waggers|<b style="color:#98F">W</b><b style="color:#97E">a</b><b style="color:#86D">g</b><b style="color:#75C">ge</b><b  style="color:#83C">r</b><b  style="color:#728">s</b>]][[User talk:Waggers|<small  style="color:#080">''TALK''</small>]] 07:18, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
::::Fair enough. [[User:DeCausa|DeCausa]] ([[User talk:DeCausa|talk]]) 07:36, 17 July 2024 (UTC)